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Europa-List: Re: Delta Juliet

Subject: Europa-List: Re: Delta Juliet
From: Hitchflight <bobhitchcock@icloud.com>
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2022 09:48:24

Hi Ivan

The short answer

Neither option is acceptable at this moment in time. Unless you write to the 
national
authority and obtain permission. Your likelihood of success holding a PMD
only is currently rated as low based on recent experience.

So all the European Union is off limits for you. I have raised with the LAA and
they have thanked the Europa Club for bringing to their attention this latest
development. They will advise the wider LAA membership as appropriate. The 
initial
response from France is not promising. We live in hope that things may change
back.

The long answer.

Ill do my best to answer the question but Im not the authority. The situation 
remains dynamic. Its a mess. Noting the CAA are seeking to change the system as 
it applies to the UK. The Europa Club engaged experts to explain the foreseen 
predicament in a Europa Club Zoom presentation. 
https://www.theeuropaclub.org/flying/flying-in-europe

Lets break it down. In your unique case. You have two licences that were issued
as PPLs. An EASA PPL and a UK PPL with ratings attached as appropriate. Im 
choosing
to ignore your CPL IR . 

EASA PPL

First assumption is that your EASA PPL was State issued by the United Kingdom at
a time when the UK was part of the European Union.
Second assumption is we are only talking about a Europa which is a Non Part 21
aircraft.

In such a scenario CAP2086 & Commission regulation 1178/2011 applied. You are 
flying
a British G-reg Europa outside UK using a UK PPL or Medical certificate.
CAP2086 confirms UK law made your pre-2021 EASA PPL and/or EASA medical legal
as a UK ICAO equivalent. With the ability to use internationally when associated
with an internationally recognised certificate. Unfortunately during the
Brexit negotiations this area was messed up in the sense that UK LAPL medical
and EASA LAPL medical became an area of contention. Mutually non-recognised at
the pan EU EASA level of government negotiations. However most sovereign 
countries
in Europe will hold valid a UK LAPL medical provided permission is sought
in advance and obtained in writing in advance from each sovereign sate with
the EU. The PMD was not discussed as it was never recognised by EASA. But was
inferred as recognised by France under an old presidential decree until very 
recently.
Remembering some of the rational predates the UK joining the EU back
in 1972. Exceptions would be granted to old historic aircraft. Fast forward to
today. Negotiations continue with the French, but unfortunately at the same time
the UK is potentially moving the goal posts by further streamlining licences.
Indeed a consultation process has already begun and the opinions of UK pilots
is currently being canvassed. In October 2022 The first part of the rule comes
---From the Arrt (Decree) : "Pilots must hold an aeronautical title issued or
recognised by the authority of the State of registry". But under a new 
interpretation
they have created a restrictive condition : "if the pilot's aeronautical
title has not been issued in accordance with ICAO Annex 1 or European 
regulations,
he will have to request authorisation".

In this scenario with this licence with this licence combined with a PMD you can
fly in the UK  ( inc. the Channel Islands if permission of obtained from the
Bailwick). Provided you dont fly at Night or on Instruments. Your plane can fly
to Europe because of ECAC approval. You cannot pilot to Europe because the
medical associated with your ICAO standard licence does not meet an 
international
standard. 

Consequently you are restricted to LAPL privileges and because it is non-ICAO,
restricted to UK airspace unless a foreign authority were to approve a unique
or serial applications to visit.

The old original Lifetime UK PPL

Assumption is we are mainly talking about a Europa which is a Non Part 21 
aircraft.
Old PPL licences with SEP ratings are valid in non Part 21 aircraft, if an
aircraft that could be flown by a LAPL(A) pilot with associated LAPL level of
medical. The association is valid in non-Part21 aircraft as if it is a UK CAA
PPL but restricted to UK Airspace only unless permitted by foreign authority.



Overview

I personally hold a UK ICAO PPL  with IR(R) and Class 2 medical certificate. I
was tempted to move to the LAPL . But fortunately I didnt only because of a 
previous
Spanish tough interpretation insistence on a Class 2. But now in all the
post Brexit confusion it seems the only gold standard for a British pilot who
wants to travel in Europe is a PPL with a Class 2 medical.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Hope it changes, but I fear it wont.

Trust that helps. Let me know if you need more.

Regards

Bob


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=508151#508151



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