Just for the guys thinking about the alloy tank prototype route, you HAVE a
prototype, If you can "Borrow"
one of the original tanks and copy it, Given it is largely flat panels, two
with curves it would be easy to copy
in a light sheet alloy or stainless. I would be happy to loan my tank other
than its installed already, I am sure
others would.
craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Venu Rao
Sent: Friday, 2 May 2008 10:26 AM
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel tank - bulges and leakage.
Count me in for my $100 too!
I might also suggest that we explore increasing this amount if the
$5,000 is an underestimate. We should run the numbers to see if those
of us who put up this seed money will get their money back as a
discount off the new tank design.
I'd like very much to see a solution asap. Knowing heat can compromise
the tank, I'm not looking forward to a searing Texas Summer. We Texans
may have to cold store in summer and fly in winter ;-)
Cheers,
Venu Rao
Austin, Texas
Europa mono - A058
Flying-132.5 hours
Builder: James Nelson
On May 1, 2008, at 15:22, Alan Burrows <alan@kestrel-insurance.com>
wrote:
<alan@kestrel-insurance.com
> >
>
> Hi Gary
>
> Having had to replace a tank and had the heartache of seeing fuel
> running
> out of the bottom of my aircraft TWICE (second time after attempting
> to
> repair the old tank). I am willing to throe my $100 into the pot.
> Count me in.
>
> Alan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary
> Leinberger
> Sent: 01 May 2008 18:02
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Europa-List: Fuel tank - bulges and leakage.
>
> <Gary.Leinberger@millersville.edu>
>
> I just replaced mine,although I did it before putting in the cockpit
> module - it is actually not too bad to do from the bottom and may in
> fact be easier from the top - but you do need to cut out the
> headrests -
> and be ready to totally destroy the old tank, and sand out pieces of
> the
> tank that end up "resined" to the rear upright of the cockpit module
> - a
> very sloppy job - the real problem when working from the top, as I see
> it - is that you can't put in the channel or T pieces from the top -
> you essentially have to work through the holes for the spars and the
> bottom hole for the fuel outlets from the tank - I was thinking
> however
> that part of the problem in this tank may be that we glass it in too
> tightly in a few places and as it moves from expansion, it works the
> plastic and we get stress cracks - this was the problem on my first
> tank
> - the stress came from using too much air pressure to test the
> system -
> but at best I only cycled the tank to expansion a few times - so if it
> failed then, it isn't too much of leap to suggest that regular
> expansion
> from temperature changes could do the same - especially if the tank is
> firmly held by fiberglass in a few places - the corner on the outside
> edge below the overhang at top seems to be a particular place to
> accumulate stress
>
> Maybe it would be smarter when replacing a tank to build a shelf below
> that the tank sits on and then strap the tank in with enough elastic
> slack to allow movement of the tank - yet still have enough strength
> to
> avoid the tank breaking loose in a crash - but the stress cracks I got
> from just a few cycles of air pressure really worry me -
>
> Perhaps some of us could get together and fund the building of a
> prototype aluminum (or something else) tank - once we had a design we
> could easily reproduce it at much lower cost - I doubt if the factory
> could do it because of the nannies in the English PFA - but we
> could do
> it in the US - I would be more than happy to put a hundred dollars
> or so
> to fund development - I don't know how many of us are worried about
> this
> but 50 builders at $100 each - is $5000 - would this be enough to do
> this? By the way a replacement tank is 110 pounds and shipping is
> another 110 pounds - total cost is over $400 - just for the tank - and
> maybe 30-50 hours to replace it - so is $100 worth of insurance each
> to
> have a better fix available worth it? I think so - any feedback from
> people that know something about the cost of prototyping - I know the
> first one is always expensive - but the second one should be a lot
> cheaper -
>
>
> Gary Leinberger
> A237
> gleinberger@millersville.edu
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Venu Rao
> Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2008 1:17 AM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuel tank - bulges and leakage.
>
>
> I'm rather concerned about this too. Going to have a look at my tank
> for
> signs of bulging.
>
> Almost certain I'm converting the mono to a conventional through Bob
> Berube. Just need to price it out.
>
> Do you know if the tank can be replaced easily?
>
> This forum is invaluable!
> Hope all's well.
> Cheers
>
> Venu
>
> Cell: (512) 771-3286
>
> On Apr 30, 2008, at 22:18, Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com> wrote:
>
>> <fklein@orcasonline.com>
>>
>> On Wednesday, Apr 30, 2008, at 13:46 US/Pacific, Sidsel & Svein
>> Johnsen wrote:
>>
>>> --> <sidsel.svein@oslo.online.no
>>>>
>>>
>>> All,
>>>
>>> Preventing the tank from bulging too much forward will of course
>>> prevent it touching any of the controls or the wing spar (in which
>>> case the strap on the left spar might catch on the bulge during
>>> withdrawal/installation).
>>
>> Before getting Svein's thoughtful and informative post (thank you
>> Svein!), I spent some time looking for a solution to potential
>> bulging
>
>> in my tank (which came w/ kit # A194, shipped from the factory in
>> fall, 2000).
>>
>> In order to "contain" the (outward) bulging, I reset my spacers
>> (which have generous curves at the corners of the specified lay up)
>> to
>
>> ensure a gap between tank (dry and never filled w/ anything) of
>> between 1/8" and 1/4" and maintaining 1/4" clearance from the aileron
>> control rod, I was planning to do the following:
>>
>> Insert a piece of 1/8" thick plywood, 6.25" x 34", w/ 1 layer of bid
>> each side between the spacers and the front face of the tank,
>> cushioning the plywood w/ 1/8" thick "sill sealer" (I believe it is a
>> closed cell polypropylene foam available in 6" rolls at any building
>> supply) between the plywood and the forward face of the tank. Prior
>> to
>
>> insertion, I would add a 3/4" x 2" x 34" foam stiffener w/ 2 layers
>> bid on the forward face of the plywood. The plywood would be held in
>> place w/ a 2 ply bid 2" wide tape which laps onto the underside of
>> the
>
>> FG "shelf" (previously installed as per manual). In doing this, my
>> goal would be to resist "bulging" of the forward face of the tank.
>>
>> Having reviewed Svein's post, I will not be doing anything until we
>> have more information, hopefully in answer to Svein's questions on
>> the
>
>> nature of the HDPE used in our tanks.
>>
>> I do appreciate so much the value of this forum as we attempt to
>> address this insidious problem.
>>
>> Fred
>>
>>
>> --
>> This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by
>> MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Checked by AVG.
> 18:10
>
>
Checked by AVG.
5:30 PM
Checked by AVG.
5:30 PM
|